How To Conquer Self-Doubt as a Mom in Business

Unedited Transcript of the Episode:

Andi: Hi, I’m Andy smiley, your friendly podcast guide. I help you start launch and grow a podcast that is fun and fulfilling. Whether you’re just starting or a few years in, I share tips stories from my own journey and insights from podcasters. I admire. Hi, I’ve missed you today. I’m sharing a bonus episode where I interview Jen Morris, who has amazing insights into being a creative, a business owner and a mom. I had so much fun chatting with her. And I had a lot of my own aha moments. So I can’t wait for you to hear this episode.

And just as a reminder, at the end of the episode, I’ll talk about the main takeaways from my conversation with Jen.

So you don’t have to take notes unless you want to.

Andi: I am so, so excited to have Jen Morris on the podcast today. She doesn’t have a podcast. That I’m aware of, but she has a lot of really interesting, like outlooks on motherhood and business. And so I had to have her on. Thank you so much for being here, Jen.

Jen: Thank you. Thanks for making an exception. I actually had a podcast during COVID that was called The Well Rounded Actor. Um, that I talked a lot about like mental, physical and emotional wellness for actors because I have an acting background. And then I had another short lived one called Renegade Motherhood, but it was more a nutrition wellness approach.

And then I had a total like just shift and everything I was doing. And so I, and I might have a podcast again in the future, but, um, I’m just not there quite yet. So, but I, I have had podcasts, so I know they’re a lot of work. And yeah, like you really have to love it to keep doing it too. I think so. I learned a lot doing my

Andi: I will say once you’ve had a podcast, then you’re probably going to have more, like that’s been my experience is once you kind of like get the taste, you’re like, Hmm, I can do a podcast about that or I can do a podcast about that. So yeah, no, I feel you. And we’re all going to be excited whenever your next podcast comes to fruition.

But also I, I am the first person to always say that. If the timing isn’t right, don’t do it. Like if a podcast is not fitting into your life, do not do it until you are ready.

Jen: Yeah. Cause there are I think more work than people think that they are.

Andi: Yeah, I feel like people either think they’re no work or too much work and, but it’s, it’s somewhere in the middle. And I think it just kind of ebbs and flows with whatever you’re doing.

Jen: Yeah.

Andi: oh, I love that. I’m, I’m glad that that’s fun. I didn’t even know that you had podcasts, but now you, now you kind of get my people, even though you currently don’t have a podcast, but you get it, you get the vibe.

Jen: Totally. Totally. No. And I think what you’re doing is awesome.

Andi: Thank you. My first question that I like to ask is, what is the last podcast you listened to for you? Not for research, not for businessy stuff, but just for you

Jen: Oh my gosh. Well, I have to say most of the time when I listen to podcasts, it’s for research or business. So, but I listened to a ton of audio books, like fictional audio books. I’m probably averaging one or two a week because I just, I just love fiction.

Andi: The second question I ask is what is a simple thing you’re doing in your life to make it better right now?

Jen: I mean, this is like kind of a big answer. It’s not like this, like, you know, one specific thing, but, um, I have been like embracing main character energy. Like I’ve spent the last year, really, um, not even a full year, but just like really getting back into like, my zone of genius, what I do best and showing up in that.

And like, it’s just fun. I have so much less self doubt. I’m, and I’m doing a lot more public speaking. And I will say if that was like a specific thing to, to point to, um, I have an acting background. I love performing. And when I, you know, and when I had kids, it just became a little bit harder to have access to that because you know, your schedule is not your own anymore.

And my priorities had shifted. Um, and so just over the last year, I’ve really stepped into more, um, public speaking, both through, you know, my business, um, through, like, a women’s chorus that I’m part of. So I just noticed that, like, when I am kind of, this is going to sound, like, egotistical, but, like, in the spotlight, I just, I, because that’s something that really, um, fuels me and, um, and draws the right people to me.

So like, as a, as a, and I think, you know, people who podcast can, can get that, like when you’re in your element, when you’re in your zone, when you have a, you know, a topic that you really can show up and talk about every week or every other week, like, you know, you know, it’s working if like, it’s, it’s, you feel good doing it.

And if like people are responding to it. And so while I’m not doing a podcast right now, I am guesting on a lot of podcasts and I’m also finding like live stages and that’s just been. Like, so, so good for me to get back into that part of my life that I was really missing.

Andi: Totally. Oh, I love that. And I think that’s different for everyone, but finding that thing that just like feeds your soul

Jen: Mm hmm.

Andi: is just the best. It’s just so good when you’re able to figure out what it is and then lean into it. So yes. Oh, I love that.

Jen: Thanks.

Andi: Thank you so much for answering those those questions are almost more for me Than for my listeners because I usually get more out of them.

Like I love the idea I I need a reminder pretty often of like being the main character of my own story because especially as a mom I feel like sometimes we just get Stuck in the mode of taking care of kids and their needs coming before ours. And we need to make sure that we take care of ourselves too, and do things that we love.

And I always just like to hear what people are listening to. Yeah, it’s, it’s pretty much for me, but I’m, I’m sure that all of you out there are also enjoying the recommendations, but, um, okay, so now we’re going to dive into some questions that I have for you, Jen, because I know that you. You just are a wealth of knowledge.

So one of the things that I’ve noticed that a lot of my community struggles with me included is self doubt and that inner critic. So what’s your advice for moms who are holding themselves back because of the little voice in their head, that’s questioning if they’re good enough to do whatever it is, start a podcast is for me and my people, but like, you know, anything that moms are holding themselves back from.

Jen: Yeah, I think like, like you said, motherhood and self doubt go hand in hand.

Andi: Yeah.

Jen: And we’re, you know, we Google like my kid isn’t sleeping. What do I do? And we’re given 85, 000 Opinions slash clinical studies slash New York Times bestsellers slash podcast slash, you know, and and it The feedback we’re getting is like, one, overwhelmed, two, like, everyone knows better than me what to do.

And so it’s like, it’s on this, we’re on this border constantly of like, of like, it’s great to have support groups, it’s great to have Facebook groups, it’s great because it can create community, but it can look, but it can also breed this sense of self doubt and insecurity, and then that feeds over into Like other things in our life So I think like the one thing is sometimes we have to like separate a little bit like there could be something going on With your family Or your kids where you are feeling like I really do need some extra support like this is beyond my depth I I do need you know a coach or a doctor or whatever to like to be a Guide for this but that doesn’t necessarily mean that like you need it in every other part of your life, too if i’m having a moment of like self doubt or imposter syndrome I have to kind of step back and be like, where is this really coming from?

Is this because Is I had a fight with my spouse over the weekend and and that is like still kind of on my mind is it because I had a really, really rough night of sleep, and so we have to kind of think about like, what are the like, other things going on that could actually be like a filter that we’re running this decision through if that if that makes sense.

Um, and then like find ways to kind of like step, step back from it. I think the other thing that I, that I’m talking about more is this idea of like, you know, Um, doing things also that’s within your zone of genius, which, you know, is something a lot of people talk about. I sort of bring this other layer of, like, main character energy, main character persona, because my acting, my background is, like, in acting, and so that’s kind of, like, some of the language that I, that I speak.

But, I think, like, what happened to me when I had kids was, I had built this whole business, It’s several businesses for many, many years before having kids. And I did a lot of public speaking, a lot of networking events, a lot of workshops, all the things. And it worked. And then I had kids and all of a sudden I was like, well, I have to do everything differently now because now I have kids and yes, I needed to change some things.

But so I was like, well, now I have to do everything online. And everyone’s saying that in order to be successful, you have to have 80, 000 funnels and 4, 000 lead magnets and you know, you have to be on sub stack and LinkedIn and Instagram and Facebook and, you know, tick tock. You can’t do all that. And so, but I was trying to do it and I was trying to like bring people onto the team that could build out all these things.

And I hated it. I was miserable because I wasn’t actually like building my business in a way that aligned with my main character energy, which is being out in front of people. And so I would say like if you’re a mom listening to this and you’re like I have an idea for a podcast or a business or a creative endeavor, like be careful about who you’re taking advice from of how to get that out into the world because if it’s not someone who A, knows what you’re trying to create, or B, understands your innate gifts, if you’re going to build it by your strengths and strengths, you’re going to try to build it someone else’s way.

And it’s probably not going to feel good. And that’s going to breed self doubt because you’re like, well, wait, I’m doing all the things they’re telling me too. And it’s not working for me. And it could be because like you’re doing things that don’t necessarily align with like how you actually want to launch a podcast, grow a business, all the things.

So, so, so yeah.

Andi: I agree with everything you said, and I think, especially Especially with what you said about, Listening to people who get you, when you have, when you listen to people who are also like in similar life stages, like we’re both moms.

So we get that we’re gonna have to do things a little differently. Like in the podcasting world, a lot, a lot, a lot of people will say you have to put on an episode every week and be consistent to grow. And. I tried that. I tried that way and I totally burned out. Like it was just not a good fit for me.

And I like almost stopped podcasting altogether. So I’m like the poster child for don’t do it someone else’s way. Do it the way that works for you and listen to people who are in similar situations. So now I really only take advice from podcast coaches who are at the very minimum, married, and anyone that I listen to, pretty much, is a mom, because they get it.

They understand. That your priorities do shift and your time allotments shift

Jen: It’s different.

Andi: you want to be with your kids sometimes. So you can’t be gone every weekend doing like networking events, you know? So I love the idea of make sure you like be intentional about who you’re listening to so that you can do what you want to do in a way that feeds you.

Jen: And like a podcast can be successful without having a million downloads, you know? And so it’s like, if you’re, if you’re listening to somebody, I think so many times we jump to what someone else’s definition of success is instead of figuring out what it is for us first.

And so it’s like, so we, we skip a step and I’ve, I mean, I can say that cause I’ve done it a hundred thousand times, you know?

I mean,

know, like let’s skip to like the end before we’ve read, you know, the first five chapters, right? And so, um, so yeah, there’s so many people out there like, you know, a successful podcast means you have sponsors. It means you have a million downloads and you’re a top, you know, 0. 001 percent of listens and everything.

And like, but that’s not necessarily why everyone gets into podcasting. Some people get into podcasting because they have a story to tell. And I think it’s awesome that you like you saw where it was going with the burnout. And I mean, that was my experience too, with podcasting, with my first show. And like, and I was like, all of a sudden I was like, I don’t like this anymore.

I was taking up so much time. Like, why am I even doing this? It’s not helping me meet my bottom line. It was fun. I’m proud of what I put out, but it’s time to. Stop for a while and see how I feel. And I didn’t miss it. And now if I do do another show, I’m much clearer on like why I would be doing the show

Andi: totally.

Jen: what I want to get out of it.

And then, yeah, look for people who, who are in, you know, kind of have some similar life experience and also know what it is you’re actually trying to create instead of forcing their idea of success on you, which I think is often what happened in a coaching situation.

Andi: Yeah, you’re totally right. When I help clients launch their podcasts, truly the first thing that we go over is there. Why, why are you doing this podcast? And. At least one of those things has to have nothing to do with anyone else.

It has to do with you. Like, if that, if your podcast is so that you can verbally process that, that’s a great reason why, or if it’s so that you have an outlet that has nothing to do with your children, that’s a great reason to have a podcast, but it isn’t like, All of your whys can’t be so that I can help other people do blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

It has to have, there has to be a reason for you, just you that you’re doing it. So I absolutely love that.

Jen: Awesome. Great.

Andi: Okay. So back to moms and businesses and hobbies and all of the things like we’re trying to be our own person, but also we’re moms. So like that can get a little messy.

I’ve noticed again, for me and for my community, my listeners that. Like boundaries are hard.

Jen: Yeah.

Andi: And I’m wondering if you have any advice for moms who are struggling with boundaries, like they want to have their own thing. They want to have a podcast. They want to have a business. They want to have a creative outlet that’s theirs, but they also want to spend time with their kids.

So they don’t know how to make those boundaries. Work on both sides. Like they don’t want to always let their kids into their creative outlet, but they also don’t want their creative outlet to take over and make it so they don’t hang out with their kids. Like, what are your thoughts on that? Any advice on boundaries?

Jen: I know that I am happier when I have other things to do that don’t involve my family. Now some people might come at me for that, like whatever, they’re not my people, so that’s fine. And the other piece is it’s part of like self care, which I honestly hate that expression, but for lack of a better one,

Then it’s like we have to communicate about it and I know for a long time I was expecting my husband to read my mind and spoiler alert, most husbands don’t have that ability. Ha

Andi: Wouldn’t it be

Jen: ha. Right.

Andi: no.

Jen: Right. And no matter what kind of relationship you’re in, any kind of relationship, that could be a friendship, it could be with a business partner, it could be with your team, like, I, you know, our kids, like, we cannot expect people to read our minds.

Um, and so, you know, for me, it was like, I, you know, being singing once a week in my chorus was important to me. Being out with people, these networking events I’m doing growing is, is important to me. It’s important to our family and it’s important to my mental health and it’s, makes me happy.

So communicating that and then like working together as a, as a family unit, you know, sometimes with your kids, pay how old your kids are to like make that happen, you know, like, so it’s not so much of like the permission seeking. Um, it’s more of like, Hey, like I’ve identified that I want to start a podcast.

So, I would like to invite you into the conversation to see how we can set this up so that I’m able to do it in a way that, you know, is fulfilling for me and isn’t, like, a huge source of stress for the family. So, can we talk about it? Um, The other side of this is like, as your kids get older, involving them in it too.

And I’m, I’m really direct with my kids, um, when I need to be, not about like every single thing. Um, but you know, I have a seven and a half year old and a four year old and. My seven and a half year old sometimes struggles when I go to choir once a week and so instead of just being like, well, I’m going because I’m going, it’s like, well, you know, Nev, you know how you really like play dates with your friends this is like kind of mom’s play date every week I get to go singing is really important to me, like, you know, before I had you, I sing all the time.

And I don’t, you know, I don’t do that as much now because I do want to spend time with you, but it’s really important for me to have that one night a week because it just really makes me happy. Um, and then you get to come see me sing in a show, which they did, you know last night. Um, and so and then when it’s a business related things that is more fun, but when it’s business related, you know, like the summit, I was gone.

I was, you know, a little more like gone last week, just prepping for stuff like that. And a couple of earlier mornings and stuff and times when I wasn’t, you know, going to drop them off. And, and I said, you know, this is mom’s big event, you know, and I really need you to be my cheerleader. And, you know, what are we going to do to celebrate when this is over?

Like, where are we going to go have dinner tonight when this is done? Yeah. And this is why I’m building this business. And so just like you said, you asked people why they’re starting their podcast. And we also have to share that with people, you know, and not just people who are going to spend money on us necessarily, or give us a download or give us a listen.

Like we really have to like share that with. Like our family unit, um, because I think so often we just look at it as like, well it’s a job to make money to put a roof over our heads or whatever, and we don’t actually go deeper with them, and so then it just allows me to like, to also then like model what that looks like, what having boundaries looks like, what putting, what putting myself first.

looks like. So I just feel like it’s such a communication. Everyone talks about communicate, communicate.

But it’s like, it’s not just saying like, Hey, I’m doing this. It’s about like, how can we share our vision with others and then also allow them to be like, actually part of kind of the conversation. Um, but from a place of this is happening.

Andi: Yes. Yes. Yeah. Not a, Hey kids, is it okay? Would you feel okay if it’s a, Hey, this is what’s happening. I’m starting a podcast. How can we make sure that you still feel loved and you still feel a part of it? And I love that you said, like, how are we going to celebrate? Cause that is one thing that I’ve started doing is like, When I wrap up a season or like I offer like podcast coaching, like group coaching packages and things like that.

And like, after a launch, I’ll bring home, um, like Martinelli’s and we’ll have Martinelli’s for dinner that night to celebrate, to be like, Hey, the hard thing’s over. Mom’s back. Like you did the thing. We did the thing. We made it through the week. And I feel like I am modeling that for my kids in a way that feels good.

When I do it right, those boundaries feel good and they don’t feel oppressive either, either way. And truly like, so I have two little girls and a boy, and I want all of my children to feel like they can go for their dreams, but I want my little girls to feel it even more because I feel like I didn’t feel that way for a very long time as, as, as a mom and even like.

As a teenager growing up, I was like, Oh no, as soon as I become a mom, my life becomes taking care of children and I don’t have a life anymore. And I do not want my little girls to feel that way. And so one of my favorite parts of starting a podcast was that my little girl who was three at the time, she started carrying around a notebook and being like, I’m working on my podcast right now.

Jen: My kids do that too. They make me renegade motherhood signs and like, you know, like my mom created renegade motherhood, but like that doesn’t happen if you don’t involve them in the conversation. Like, so that’s where it is this sort of, you know, not everything has to bleed into everything all the time at all.

You do have to have those boundaries, but like the vision, the reason why like that needs to become part of like a fabric of the family, because especially when it is an entrepreneurial endeavor, because. You know, it, it, it is. It’s just different. It’s different. It’s more mission based. It’s more movement based versus, you know, a, a job where maybe it’s like, I have to go, but like when I clock out, I clock out and I don’t want to think about it as entrepreneurs and creative, you know, people it’s kind of always there.

And so we have to learn how to turn that off, but also to when it is there a little bit more one week to be able to like. Explain why and create excitement and make it like a team effort so that everybody feels the payoff and not just the stress

Andi: Yes. Well, and I think, and I really love, I love that, that you talked about like communicating more than just, hey, this is going to happen, but like, this is why I’m doing this is so that I can like feel happy. Like we want you to feel happy, but also we want mom to feel happy and mom deserves happiness just as much as you do.

And I think. That feels so selfish the first time you say it to your kids. At least it did for me. And I think the more that I’ve said it, the more I’ve realized that it’s actually not selfish because I’m helping my children learn that their happiness matters, no matter what, if they become a parent,

when they get married, whatever, whatever it is like their happiness always matters.

Jen: Yes. And when you’re happier, they’re happier. And so it’s like, yeah, yeah, totally. So it’s a win

Andi: is so hard to not feel selfish about that sometimes. Yes,

Jen: I think that, you know, we’re trying to now like kind of unlearn and yeah. So,

Andi: totally. Oh

Jen: and it’s not always easy too. I mean, it’s easy to get on podcasts and be like, I just am so great at communicating.

And my family always has my back. Like, no, that’s not at all. 70 percent of the time, like everyone’s, you know, hanging in there. It’s like, great. But there are mornings that they don’t want to go to school or they don’t this, or they really don’t want me to, I know this week I’ve got choir tomorrow.

And then I’ve got a board meeting, um, the board I’m part of on Wednesday. And I kind of forgot about that. And so I know they’re going to be like, you said you’d be home this week. And I’m going to feel, I’m going to feel some guilt, you know, but it’s just, it’s. It’s, yeah, it’s just, it’s having to like, just be really clear, like, Hey, I totally understand.

Yeah, you’re right. I have, I have been busy, but, um, you know, it’s, it’s like the reason that I do this is because of this. And the reason that I do this is because of this, and I know you may not always understand, but you know, I love you and I’ll be back in time for bed or, you know, whatever that is. So yeah.

Andi: And I think seeing, seeing your mistakes as like learning opportunities, be like, Ooh, crap, I did forget about that board meeting. And I did tell them I was going to do that. Like, okay, so what can I do differently next time? So that doesn’t happen, you know, like, okay, okay. Let’s see what

Jen: More Martinelli’s.

Andi: maybe And maybe like, even involving your kids in that, like, y’all, I just messed up. What can we do differently so this doesn’t happen again because this is not a great, this isn’t great and I don’t want this to happen again. Like, I see that this is not a good thing. , I love that. So one thing that I am trying to get better at, and I know I’ve talked to a lot of people, like a lot of my listeners, who feel similarly, we know that like networking is a really good thing about building a community, helping people learn about our podcasts, learn about our side hustles, whatever.

But it can be really hard. So how, how have you like figured out how to network as a mom? Cause I feel like for me, I do, I like going to networking events, but like finding them and then like making sure that they’re a good fit. And like all of those little details can be really hard. So do you have any like thoughts on that?

Jen: I couldn’t find it, so I created my own.

Andi: Oh, there you go. Oh.

Jen: I mean, I agree. Like, networking is a huge part of my story. Um, you know, I joined my first professional networking group when I was like 27 and living in New York City and like really didn’t even know what networking was. Um, Yeah. But, uh, but then, even though I was part of that, that organization for many, many years, and, and I, was amazing and taught me a lot about networking and business development.

It was like a weekly 7 a. m. meeting. Um, and when I had my first daughter, I took her to one meeting and like the little bucket and I was like, she, she was asleep. And as soon as that meeting started, she woke up and screamed the whole time. I was like, it’s been really all, I’m out. You know, it’s been a fun couple of years, but so, Um, I think for moms specifically, like, I mean, I could totally shamelessly, like, plug, you know, what I, what I have going on, but,

I think there’s lots of also different ways to network. So, I don’t think that, like, you have to, in order to network, you don’t have to, it doesn’t mean you have to be going to, like, you know, a chamber event or a BNI, which was the group I was in, which, again, a great group, and if you’re in a place where, like, you can commit to, like, a weekly kind of event, Cool.

I think the key is, like, if, so we’re, if we’re talking about networking groups, I’ll kind of talk about a couple different things. If we’re talking about networking groups, like, the biggest thing is, like, if you find one that you do like, go as often as you can. And, like, find a place that maybe there isn’t an attendance policy, because I do find those are really tricky, because your kids, you know, wake, you have the best of intentions, and your kid wakes up puking, and, like, you can’t go.

So finding groups that, like, meet enough that you can, you know, plug in consistently, but aren’t so rigid that, like, you feel like you’re afraid to join, because if you do, like, and you can’t go, you’re gonna be, like, ostracized.

Cause there are some groups that are pretty hardcore like that, and I think If you’ve got young kids, those can be, those can be tricky. Um, I think, however, there are like other ways you can network. So if you are somebody that’s, you know, involved in your kid’s school, for example, Um, and there’s some people there that you’re kind of like, Oh, you know, they’re cool, but I don’t really know them.

Like be like, y’all want to just have like a cup of coffee, like some morning. You know, like I’d love to know more about like what you do or who you are. And like, you know, I have a podcast and I’m kind of just curious to meet more people in the community, like. You can, you can sort of start your own thing and like invite people in, like, I don’t, you know, I think oftentimes we think of networking as this very transactional experience where you walk into a room and you get like, you know, literally like people just like throw business cards at you and, and, you know, like, and, and you’re just like kind of assaulted by business cards and, you know, like aggressive handshakes, but like networking can literally be striking up a conversation, you know, with somebody new at a company.

Yeah. PTA meeting at the grocery store at, you just never know, but I think we live in this world now where people are just like afraid to talk to each other and some of that is, you know, like, I don’t blame people sometimes, um, and, you know, I, I also say this as a, as a white woman of privilege, so I, it is safer for me in many spaces to, to do that and so I want to like be very upfront about that too.

But, um, but I think sometimes we have opportunities right in front of us in social circles we’ve already created, and we’re just kind of not necessarily seeing it. Um, I also think that there’s a lot of online networking happening now, and, you know, to me, it doesn’t necessarily replace in person networking.

Um, but, you know, as part of like my community, there’s also a digital group. So and that’s really so that if you don’t live somewhere where there’s like a live meeting happening every month, you can still plug in and show up on zoom. Um, So, but I think if anything, if you do find a group that you do like to go to, then the key is to go consistently.

I mean, it’s just like, you don’t, you don’t go to the gym once and then you don’t go back for a year. I think sometimes people are like, networking doesn’t work, but when you really sit down and like, see what you’re doing, like, you’re like, well, I went to like, eight different groups one time and I didn’t get any business.

Networking is relationship building. And most of the time, you know, you don’t like book a sale or make a sale by giving someone a business card. It just is not like that. You think about, you think, yeah, it’s like you think about sometimes how many times we like find a pair of shoes and we’re like, Oh, I really like those.

And we still like have them in our cart. And then we’re like, Oh, I’m going to wait till the price drops. And then, Oh, I don’t know if I should really buy these right now. And then like six months later, we buy the shoes, you know, and that’s like a shoe, like a 30 pair of shoes or a, you know, a, Skin care product or something.

We still like have all of these like, you know, we just I have all this stuff Like sitting in a cart right now that I want to like take advantage of a breakfast down I still haven’t done it just because life, you know So it’s like it’s like you have to go into networking any kind of networking situation whether it’s online whether it’s linkedin Whether it’s instagram and that’s networking too, whether it’s a live, you know a live group like If you’re going in with the intention of what is in this for me, it is not going to work for you.

If you’re going in with the intention of like, I’m curious, who can I meet here? Does this energetically vibe with me and feel like a space I want to come back to? And like, you don’t have to come back if you’re like, oh, this was like a bunch of weirdos, like I have no interest. Like, that’s cool. But like, oftentimes I think it’s like, well, I’m just going to go to as many different groups as I can instead of actually finding one that you like and then putting in the, like, time and effort to build the relationships, which will then actually work for you.

I mean, I was in a BNI group for years, running the meetings, all this stuff, and it wasn’t until, like, year four that I actually got a referral that has since become, like, a multi six figure referral. But it did not happen the first meeting. It did not happen the first year. It did not happen the second year.

And I think we have this instant gratification kind of culture that we live in now of like I’m going to post something and I’m going to get 12 likes within three seconds that we forget that like when it comes to like actually building like a strategic networking group for, you know, like a network for yourself, you have to like be a human being, you have to show up and you have to like play the long game.

And like, and that’s, yeah. That’s kind of it. So,

Andi: Oh, I love it. Okay, but I do want to hear your shameless plug for your networking sit thing.

Jen: yeah, so I, I started a different group a couple years ago in Denver and that was pre COVID and then COVID just tanked it because it was really live. We tried to kind of move to zoom and people were so zoom, you know, overwhelmed at that point that it just never happened. Then I had a second kiddo, and coming out of that I was really wanting to get back in person with people, but I, I just was like, I knew very clearly I wanted to be with moms for that reason we talked about earlier of like people who kind of understand, like if you walk in and you’ve got coffee all over your shirt, like, like, cool, not just me, you know, like you too, you had a bad morning too, you know, like, oh, I need to breastfeed my kid, like, that’s just, that was the world that I wanted to be playing, the playground, the sandbox I wanted to play in.

Yeah. So I, um, so I was like, I posted in a Facebook group, you know, like, Hey, like any other moms in business want to get together for coffee? And there was like two likes and one comment. But then a couple of weeks later, 10, 10 to 12 of us got together. And that was kind of the beginning. And at first it was really informal.

And then I realized like, this is, this is what I want to be like doing. So now it’s called renegade motherhood. And we do have, um, four live locations right now, three in Colorado, one in Phoenix. Um, and yeah, and, uh, and then we have a digital community too.

It’s called the Mothermind Collective. I think I’m changing the name to like Renegade Motherhood All Access. I’m not sure yet. Um, but that is a digital group. So that’s a, it’s a paid, I think affordable, like paid community. And through that, there’s also coaching hours. There’s, um, there’s a small group like masterminds and, um, you know, digital connection and networking and workshops and things like that.

I bring in some guest experts. Um, so that’s something where you can live anywhere, but I’m really looking to expand and really grow locations throughout the country so that there’s, you know, representation and other places because I still really believe in the power of, like, if you can get a bunch of entrepreneurial, you know, trailblazing moms in a room together, um, it’s, it’s magic.

It’s pretty cool what can

Andi: Totally. Well, and I’ve noticed I’ve been able to make some like real life friends, like online, like on Instagram and other social media, but I’ve noticed that like, it doesn’t become like real until we meet in person. And I feel like it, it just makes the process go faster when you just meet in person to

Jen: Oh, yeah. I know with you, I’m like, I want you to like, I want you to come to a meeting. You’re awesome. Like it would be Yeah. Like, I

know, and it just doesn’t, there’s just something about the hug or the hand, you know, the handshake, the thing that just like makes it real. Yeah.

Andi: Totally. Yeah. And it’s just, yeah, totally. I agree. So yeah. Uh, open one in Utah, please. So that I can go,

Jen: We should talk. Maybe you wanna

Andi: I know that’d be fun. Oh man. Okay. Another time, another call.

Jen: Yeah, totally. Yeah,

Andi: as we’re wrapping up, I want you to tell all of my people, and I guess I want to hear too, um, how can people find you, how can people learn more from you?

Jen: totally. So you can go to renegade motherhood.com and that’s where event listings are. You can learn more about the digital community there. Um, and I also have a. quiz that you can take that tells you your main character persona and then will give you, um, more of, like, the benefits, the possible challenges to look out for, and then actually ways, um, when you’re really embracing your main character persona to build your own stage, you know, of visibility, and then also, um, How to build your network in a strategic way.

So you can take that quiz there. Um, and then, yeah, if you, if you live in like, you know, Colorado, Phoenix area, you can check out live events. Um, I’m also going to be doing more, um, kind of sneak peeks, digital workshops and networking events too, that people who are curious and want to come and, you know, Check things out.

So depending when this airs It could be up there. We’ll see but everything’s on renegademotherhood. com and then instagram is renegade. motherhood And i’m also um, I hang out on it’s at it’s jen morris as well on instagram Um, oh and I have a facebook group. I always forget to mention this on podcasts, but a facebook group Um that we can put in the show notes, which is open to moms and business throughout the country So we’re at Almost 600 people.

I think it was local to, to our area at first. And then I was like, let’s just open it up. So that’s growing. And I don’t have a ton of like rules around it. I know a lot of the groups have tons of rules of when you can post and like what minute of the day you can post about what, um, haven’t felt a need to have that much structure yet.

So we’ll see, could change, but, but you can definitely, um, join that group there too.

Andi: Yes. Okay. I’ll make sure to put all that in the show notes so that we can find you wherever we want to find you. And this has been delightful. Thank you so much for being on the show today.

Jen: Thank you. You, and you’re an awesome interviewer. You have really good questions and, um, which, you know, not everybody does. So I just want to reflect that back to you.

Andi: It is something I have been working on for quite some time, so I’m really glad that it’s paying off.

Jen: Love it. Thanks for having me.

Andi: Isn’t Jen just delightful. Her energy and her insights into business and just being a creative human are off the charts. Amazing.

Now here’s a quick recap of what Jen and I talked about. First embracing main character energy helps you live to your fullest potential and also helps you. To be your happiest self, which we all want. Right, right.

The second takeaway is one way that you can deal with self doubt and your inner critic is to make sure that when you try something new, start a business, do something creative that you’re doing it in a way that feeds your soul and works best for you. Not just because someone told you to do it that way. , I know from personal experience that when I try to fit myself into someone else’s mold. I’m always going to not do it perfectly because it’s not my mold, so it’s not going to work out the way that I want it to, because I’m doing it someone else’s way instead of my own way. The third takeaway is the best way to form and hold boundaries around family work and your own self. Is communication. Talk through. What boundaries you need and why they’re in place. Right.

I feel like it makes so much sense, but sometimes we just need that reminder. I definitely need that reminder too. Take a step back and over-communicate so for me, I need to remind my family, Hey, I have this podcast because it makes me happy. And also to help contribute financially for our family.

So that when I go to a podcast conference that takes me away from them for four days, then everyone knows why I’m there.

And they not only know why I’m there, but they can also cheer me on because they know that I’m following my dreams.

The fourth takeaway is if you’re wanting to meet people and do some more networking to help more people know about your podcast and just to find people that you connect with, look at the groups that you’re already a part of, like the women in your kids’ classes or the people in your high fitness class and ask them. If you can get to know them a little bit better, if that’s going for a coffee or. Maybe it’s just having a conversation with them. That’s more than just about the weather or your kids.

Would you share this episode with your friend who also has a creative endeavor? If that’s a podcast or a regular painting class that they go to, we all need these reminders as moms who are trying to carve out time for ourselves. I have missed putting out regular episodes, but it has given me the time and space to plan some super fun things for season three.

So keep an eye out. Season three comes back the first Tuesday in March. Thanks for being here and I’ll see you in the spring.